History Turkey discussion thread

To elaborate on the above post, see this brief article as just one example.
There are plenty of videos where some of the Turkish youth blocked the path of these ZIM container trucks. The government just pretends this is not happening at all for whatever reason. There was something similar in Egypt where an Israeli ship passed through the waters with the escort/protection of the Egyptians themselves jfl. What foreigners don't understand is that a lot of these Arab governments/countries are compromised at the top aswell. There are exceptions but in general there's plenty of subversion going on. Islam is not as bullet proof as you imagine it to be.
Also see these two videos.
Cement, chemicals, even gunpowder, barbed wire and parts for weapons were also sent. It has now been revealed that this trade never stopped but continued uninterrupted routed through Palestine.

Nevertheless, in his speech in Istanbul on Monday, Erdoğan claimed without blushing, “We are the country that has given the most aid to Gaza. We have completely stopped trade with Israel. We have sacrificed a trade volume of $9.5 billion.”
That settles it. Erdogan is a conman in bed with the Zionists. Right when I started thinking the Middle East situation was taking a turn for the better, too.
 
That settles it. Erdogan is a conman in bed with the Zionists. Right when I started thinking the Middle East situation was taking a turn for the better, too.
I take a more nuanced view there. It is common for Turks to be radicalized towards one direction or another. The thing is that when I look at Erdoğan's actions and generally what is happening, I can't say he's fully a conman. He does good things too here and there. That's why you see me saying Erdoğan shouldn't fall and at the same time saying he's all talk but no action. They might seem contradictory stances at first but once you observe the situation as much as I have, you realize it's just not that simple:

The key point was the 2016 coup attempt on Erdoğan, up until that point Erdoğan's policies were more pro-west leaning overall. I think Erdoğan was in bed with the zionists, but I also think that he slowly woke up over the years. During the events of 2016 the west tried to pull on Turkey the same thing they did to Ukraine in 2014. That being another euro maidan. But this time it failed, the Turks were simply more resistant than the Ukrainians. After that, Erdoğan kept becoming more and more authoritarian, correcting mistakes here and there. One example is pulling out of the İstanbul Convention which is basically a tool to destroy the marriage institution. I could give many examples but to put it simply, he improved his performance over time.

And this bothered those in the west very, very much. As we speak the Turkish government is keeping itself busy by cracking down on Kurdish protesters in Eastern Turkey. A fully zionist government would not do that. They'd straight up support the Kurds in their endeavor if anything, that would contribute to establishing greater israel after all.

So yeah, if someone says Erdoğan is cucked I won't say they're wrong, just that it's more complicated than they assume. I'd define the current Turkish government as half-cucked. It would be fully cucked if the opposition party was in charge so obviously if I had only two choices I'd pick Erdoğan's party. Luckily there are more than two choices.
 
I take a more nuanced view there. It is common for Turks to be radicalized towards one direction or another. The thing is that when I look at Erdoğan's actions and generally what is happening, I can't say he's fully a conman. He does good things too here and there. That's why you see me saying Erdoğan shouldn't fall and at the same time saying he's all talk but no action. They might seem contradictory stances at first but once you observe the situation as much as I have, you realize it's just not that simple:

The key point was the 2016 coup attempt on Erdoğan, up until that point Erdoğan's policies were more pro-west leaning overall. I think Erdoğan was in bed with the zionists, but I also think that he slowly woke up over the years. During the events of 2016 the west tried to pull on Turkey the same thing they did to Ukraine in 2014. That being another euro maidan. But this time it failed, the Turks were simply more resistant than the Ukrainians. After that, Erdoğan kept becoming more and more authoritarian, correcting mistakes here and there. One example is pulling out of the İstanbul Convention which is basically a tool to destroy the marriage institution. I could give many examples but to put it simply, he improved his performance over time.

And this bothered those in the west very, very much. As we speak the Turkish government is keeping itself busy by cracking down on Kurdish protesters in Eastern Turkey. A fully zionist government would not do that. They'd straight up support the Kurds in their endeavor if anything, that would contribute to establishing greater israel after all.

So yeah, if someone says Erdoğan is cucked I won't say they're wrong, just that it's more complicated than they assume. I'd define the current Turkish government as half-cucked. It would be fully cucked if the opposition party was in charge so obviously if I had only two choices I'd pick Erdoğan's party. Luckily there are more than two choices.
But why secretly trade with Israel still? Is the Turkiye government that desperate for Israel’s resources that they’ll throw out their dignity by siding with the enemy for power?
 
But why secretly trade with Israel still? Is the Turkiye government that desperate for Israel’s resources that they’ll throw out their dignity by siding with the enemy for power?
That's the thing. I don't know. Whenever they are confronted about it, they either straight up lie by saying there is no trade or they just don't even acknowledge it. I'm in the dark as much as you are. Turkish politics are as complicated and strange as American politics, if not more. I imagine there's plenty of things going on behind the scenes that we simply don't know about.
 
The want for a NATO-shaped shield from Iranian missiles is why Erdogan stays superficially loyal to NATO/Israel. This next decade after Iran gets flattened financially (and then totally after Mahmoud gets killed by the Jewish Space Laser) will see Turkey leave NATO and then we will see if he puts his money where his mouth is on Israel. It will be a fun show to watch on my phone while laying in bed, gazing over my obese stomach covered by a grease stained tanktop in America (greatest country).
 
Commemorative coin of the Organization of Turkic States.
thumbs_b_c_e627e3e99c025847cb4ebffac156ae6c.webp

Hungary is also on the coin. Looks pretty nice.
 
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I talked about how Turkey maintained good relations with the heckin' nazis, now let's also see the other side of the coin.

While people in this country often observe the nationalist struggle during the turkish war of independence with admiration for what we achieved, they overlook the fact that Turks couldn't have done it alone. Atatürk himself admits to this, stating that if it weren't for the aid received from a certain country, the nationalist movement would have achieved a far more difficult victory or, God forbid, a defeat. And what certain country is that? It is Russia.

The Soviet Union was the first country to establish diplomatic ties with the Ankara government as far as I'm aware, and they looked at this independence struggle with sympathy from the very beginning. On 26 April 1920, Atatürk offered to establish diplomatic ties with the Soviets, and Georgy Chicherin accepted this. In his letter, these words are written:

"The Soviet Government follows with lively interest the heroic struggle of the Turkish people for their independence and sovereignty. We would like to state that we are happy to lay the solid foundation of friendship that will unite the Turkish and Russian people in these difficult days for Türkiye."

The first thing the soviets did upon realizing the Ankara government would suit their interests against the western imperialists was to renounce their historical claim on Constantinople and Southern Armenia. The Russian Empire fought the Ottomans to get those lands, and they did get pretty close to taking Constantinople one time.

Atatürk requested aid from Russia, and Russians kept their promises by sending that aid.

According to Soviet official data, in accordance with the agreements dated 1920 and the Treaty of March 16, 1921, 39,000 rifles, 327 machine guns, 54 cannons, 63 million cartridges, 147,000 cannons were sent to Turkey from the Russian ports of Novorossiysk, Tuapse and Batumi between 1920 and 1922. From the eastern borders of Turkey, the military equipment left by the former Russian Army in 1918 was shipped. In 1921, two hunting boats named "Jivoy" and "Jutkiy" were donated. The Soviet Government helped establish two gunpowder factories in Ankara and provided the necessary equipment and raw materials for the cartridge factory. In addition, in 1920, the Soviet diplomatic mission, headed by Undersecretary Y.Y.Umpal-Angarskiy, delivered 200.6 kilos of gold bullion promised to the Turkish side during the Moscow negotiations to the representatives of the Turkish Grand National Assembly. M.V.Frunze gave 100,000 gold rubles to the Turkish authorities in Trabzon for the establishment of an orphanage for orphaned children of veterans. At the same time, several batches of weapons were delivered. On May 3, 1922, Soviet Russia's Ankara Representative S.I. Aralov delivered 3.5 million gold rubles, the last tranche of the 10 million gold rubles promised during the signing of the 1921 Treaty, to the Ankara Government.

Albeit, this aid did not come for free. Generally the Soviets demanded the new Turkish government to adopt their ideas for this new state they would establish. Adopt bolshevism, that is. Did Atatürk do that? Not really but he gave the impression of doing that, a communist political party was established and they were allowed to operate within the country for a while. Atatürk cracked down on some of them after he was properly in power, only the ones he deemed to be an actual threat. The so-called Turkish Communist Party still exists today. I recall they once won elections somewhere and then public transport was offered for free there, the locals were pretty confused. They're mostly harmless, seen as funny guys or whatever.

In March - April 1922, when the Great Offensive was being prepared, Russian Ambassador S.I.Aralov, Soviet Military Attaché K.K.Zvonaryev and Azerbaijan's first Representative Ibrahim Abilov visited the National Forces upon the invitation of Mustafa Kemal Atatürk. The guests of Russia and Azerbaijan visited the headquarters of the infantry and cavalry divisions, two armies and two corps, inspected the logistics units in Konya and attended the anniversary celebrations of the National Army. After the rallies, Russian representatives distributed small gifts to Turkish soldiers with the words "From the Red Army of Soviet Russia - to Turkish soldiers" written on them.

After the Treaty of Lausanne was signed, Türkiye gained state independence, foreign armies withdrew from Turkish territory, and the Grand National Assembly declared Turkey a Republic on October 29, 1923. In the telegram sent by Mihail Kalinin, Chairman of the Central Executive Committee of the USSR, dated October 31, 1923, it was stated: "On behalf of the people and the Government of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics... I congratulate the brotherly Turkish people, on the occasion of the proclamation of the Republic of Turkey... and I warmly greet the friendly Government of Türkiye. We congratulate you, His Excellency Marshal Gazi Mustafa Kemal Pasha, on your election as the President of the Republic of Turkey, and we salute the distinguished leader of the heroic struggle of the Turkish people and the President of the friendly Turkish Government elected by the Turkish people. I have the firm belief that the unshakable bonds of friendship between the peoples and governments of Türkiye and the USSR will gradually strengthen and contribute to the prosperous development of the two states.'

And lastly, Atatürk had to say the following about all this aid received from Russia:

'If it were not for the support of Russia, the new Turkey's victory over the invaders would have been won with incomparably greater losses, or perhaps would not have been possible at all. Russia has provided both moral and material aid to Turkey, and it would be a crime for our nation to forget this aid.'

There's a Soviet movie from the time, 1934 to be specific, it's called Ankara : Heart of Turkey.
I couldn't find it in English anywhere and it seems to be only available in Russian and Turkish. But it can be seen here if that matters. These are some gemmy recordings, they filmed the capital with planes. Skip to 13:20 to see the Soviet and Turkish flag together.
 
I talked about how Turkey maintained good relations with the heckin' nazis, now let's also see the other side of the coin.

While people in this country often observe the nationalist struggle during the turkish war of independence with admiration for what we achieved, they overlook the fact that Turks couldn't have done it alone. Atatürk himself admits to this, stating that if it weren't for the aid received from a certain country, the nationalist movement would have achieved a far more difficult victory or, God forbid, a defeat. And what certain country is that? It is Russia.

The Soviet Union was the first country to establish diplomatic ties with the Ankara government as far as I'm aware, and they looked at this independence struggle with sympathy from the very beginning. On 26 April 1920, Atatürk offered to establish diplomatic ties with the Soviets, and Georgy Chicherin accepted this. In his letter, these words are written:

"The Soviet Government follows with lively interest the heroic struggle of the Turkish people for their independence and sovereignty. We would like to state that we are happy to lay the solid foundation of friendship that will unite the Turkish and Russian people in these difficult days for Türkiye."

The first thing the soviets did upon realizing the Ankara government would suit their interests against the western imperialists was to renounce their historical claim on Constantinople and Southern Armenia. The Russian Empire fought the Ottomans to get those lands, and they did get pretty close to taking Constantinople one time.

Atatürk requested aid from Russia, and Russians kept their promises by sending that aid.

According to Soviet official data, in accordance with the agreements dated 1920 and the Treaty of March 16, 1921, 39,000 rifles, 327 machine guns, 54 cannons, 63 million cartridges, 147,000 cannons were sent to Turkey from the Russian ports of Novorossiysk, Tuapse and Batumi between 1920 and 1922. From the eastern borders of Turkey, the military equipment left by the former Russian Army in 1918 was shipped. In 1921, two hunting boats named "Jivoy" and "Jutkiy" were donated. The Soviet Government helped establish two gunpowder factories in Ankara and provided the necessary equipment and raw materials for the cartridge factory. In addition, in 1920, the Soviet diplomatic mission, headed by Undersecretary Y.Y.Umpal-Angarskiy, delivered 200.6 kilos of gold bullion promised to the Turkish side during the Moscow negotiations to the representatives of the Turkish Grand National Assembly. M.V.Frunze gave 100,000 gold rubles to the Turkish authorities in Trabzon for the establishment of an orphanage for orphaned children of veterans. At the same time, several batches of weapons were delivered. On May 3, 1922, Soviet Russia's Ankara Representative S.I. Aralov delivered 3.5 million gold rubles, the last tranche of the 10 million gold rubles promised during the signing of the 1921 Treaty, to the Ankara Government.

Albeit, this aid did not come for free. Generally the Soviets demanded the new Turkish government to adopt their ideas for this new state they would establish. Adopt bolshevism, that is. Did Atatürk do that? Not really but he gave the impression of doing that, a communist political party was established and they were allowed to operate within the country for a while. Atatürk cracked down on some of them after he was properly in power, only the ones he deemed to be an actual threat. The so-called Turkish Communist Party still exists today. I recall they once won elections somewhere and then public transport was offered for free there, the locals were pretty confused. They're mostly harmless, seen as funny guys or whatever.

In March - April 1922, when the Great Offensive was being prepared, Russian Ambassador S.I.Aralov, Soviet Military Attaché K.K.Zvonaryev and Azerbaijan's first Representative Ibrahim Abilov visited the National Forces upon the invitation of Mustafa Kemal Atatürk. The guests of Russia and Azerbaijan visited the headquarters of the infantry and cavalry divisions, two armies and two corps, inspected the logistics units in Konya and attended the anniversary celebrations of the National Army. After the rallies, Russian representatives distributed small gifts to Turkish soldiers with the words "From the Red Army of Soviet Russia - to Turkish soldiers" written on them.

After the Treaty of Lausanne was signed, Türkiye gained state independence, foreign armies withdrew from Turkish territory, and the Grand National Assembly declared Turkey a Republic on October 29, 1923. In the telegram sent by Mihail Kalinin, Chairman of the Central Executive Committee of the USSR, dated October 31, 1923, it was stated: "On behalf of the people and the Government of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics... I congratulate the brotherly Turkish people, on the occasion of the proclamation of the Republic of Turkey... and I warmly greet the friendly Government of Türkiye. We congratulate you, His Excellency Marshal Gazi Mustafa Kemal Pasha, on your election as the President of the Republic of Turkey, and we salute the distinguished leader of the heroic struggle of the Turkish people and the President of the friendly Turkish Government elected by the Turkish people. I have the firm belief that the unshakable bonds of friendship between the peoples and governments of Türkiye and the USSR will gradually strengthen and contribute to the prosperous development of the two states.'

And lastly, Atatürk had to say the following about all this aid received from Russia:

'If it were not for the support of Russia, the new Turkey's victory over the invaders would have been won with incomparably greater losses, or perhaps would not have been possible at all. Russia has provided both moral and material aid to Turkey, and it would be a crime for our nation to forget this aid.'

There's a Soviet movie from the time, 1934 to be specific, it's called Ankara : Heart of Turkey.
I couldn't find it in English anywhere and it seems to be only available in Russian and Turkish. But it can be seen here if that matters. These are some gemmy recordings, they filmed the capital with planes. Skip to 13:20 to see the Soviet and Turkish flag together.
This is a fascinating and often overlooked aspect of modern Turkish history. I don't recall any political leader in history essentially larping their way to victory.
 
'If it were not for the support of Russia, the new Turkey's victory over the invaders would have been won with incomparably greater losses, or perhaps would not have been possible at all. Russia has provided both moral and material aid to Turkey, and it would be a crime for our nation to forget this aid.'
Where is this quote from? I couldn't locate a source anywhere.
 
Where is this quote from? I couldn't locate a source anywhere.
Official website of the Russian Embassy in Turkey.
The quote is at the very top. You likely didn't find a source because this is all in Turkish. I suspect it's from one of Atatürk's many letters to the Russians, it's probably in some dusty old archive as we speak. I'll try to find this specific letter but I can't make promises.
 
Official website of the Russian Embassy in Turkey.
The quote is at the very top. You likely didn't find a source because this is all in Turkish. I suspect it's from one of Atatürk's many letters to the Russians, it's probably in some dusty old archive as we speak. I'll try to find this specific letter but I can't make promises.
You are like the Turkish version of Karenin.
 
The crowd chants "Take us to Jerusalem!" towards Erdoğan. He responds in Arabic by saying "Men Sabera Zafera" (Victory belongs to those who are patient).

I think this is a quote of Muhammad. We shall see whether patience will really lead us to victory.
 
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